23 comments

  • Dan GDan G, over 5 years ago (edited over 5 years ago )

    eh

    This image is hilarious.

    27 points
    • Account deleted over 5 years ago

      Somebody doesn't know what ascenders and descenders are.

      26 points
      • Lin ZagorskiLin Zagorski, over 5 years ago

        You'd think that such a detailed takedown of a fucking keyboard would warrant the tiniest bit of typography research.

        13 points
        • Dan GDan G, over 5 years ago

          It's almost if a depressingly large amount of people who consider themselves designers have little to no idea about the basics.

          4 points
      • Eli SchiffEli Schiff, over 5 years ago

        As explained in the post, I find variation in letter heights not to be a problem. In fact I argued their benefit:

        The case shifting keyboard makes visual differentiation of keys in the lower case state easy to visually due to their varying footprints.

        You're quite right that in pointing out the obvious: variation in letter height is inherent to lowercase type.

        This image is included to illustrate the preferenceheldbymany that keyboards be all caps to have a more uniform and harmonious aesthetic.

        This isn't an "is" question about the nature of ascenders and descenders in lowercase letterforms, it's a matter of whether they "ought" to be used in this context.

        17 points
        • Dan GDan G, over 5 years ago

          Without wanting to get bogged down into an argument, if you want to prove that it's a 'preference held by many' you should link to better sources. You've linked to single persons tweet that has four favourites…twice. That's not really proving your point.

          Also for someone who's entire schtick is that the design world needs more people who stand up and critique, you're weirdly dismissive of people who disagree with you. I've just had a quick look at your Twitter and there's a tweet linking to this page about how we're 'haters'. It's embarrassing.

          4 points
          • Eli SchiffEli Schiff, over 5 years ago

            you should link to better sources.

            Since the sources here are insufficient for you, you're invited to read the article again, where you'll find I had included even more sources.

            for someone who's [sic] entire schtick is that the design world needs more people who stand up and critique, you're weirdly dismissive of people who disagree with you.

            When the response to my articles on this forum no longer amounts to ad hominem and tu quoque arguments, fallacies of relative privation, misdirection, tone-arguments, etc. then we can talk about the so-called "critique" emerging from Designer News.

            4 points
    • John PJohn P, over 5 years ago

      Didn't even realise there was more article below the advert until I checked the comments and saw this

      3 points
  • Sean LesterSean Lester, over 5 years ago

    Your criticism of the shift key in NO WAY necessitates the need for a skeumorphic solution. It could literally be solved with color, such as the inclusion of blue.

    23 points
  • Sean O'GradySean O'Grady, over 5 years ago

    I had to stop at "utterly illegible". Utterly hyperbolic.

    18 points
    • Wil NicholsWil Nichols, over 5 years ago

      While hyperbolic, there are very valid points made, and solutions to many of these problems are explored.

      14 points
      • Nathan NNathan N, over 5 years ago

        All I saw was an additional layer of affordances, that isn't innovative, it's merely nitpicking based on personal preferences. It's the entire point of his blog.

        10 points
        • Raphael LoderRaphael Loder, over 5 years ago

          All I saw was an additional layer of affordances

          You speak as if that weren't helpful or good?

          8 points
          • Nathan NNathan N, over 5 years ago

            Not when paired with the tone of the article. He has no real evidence that 'dimensional design' is superior to any other aesthetic. What would be innovative is to design a new pattern for mobile keyboards and illustrate through real UX how this keyboard is more legible than what is currently available. That type of work is worthy of an MFA or a research grant.

            2 points
            • Raphael LoderRaphael Loder, over 5 years ago

              Not when paired with the tone of the article.

              I mean, meh. Even if the person you are addressing isn't really likeable or you simply don't like, you can still dissect their arguments rationally. Even if said person isn't doing it themselves (which I'm neither claiming nor denying).

              He has no real evidence that 'dimensional design' is superior to any other aesthetic […]

              Eh, what? Hasn't it been proven many times over that "dimension", "depth" or other visual cues greatly improve usability? Nielsen-Norman group puts this out:

              Make buttons at least remotely resemble physical buttons. In order for an object to be recognizable, it must retain the right visual cues to trigger the right associations quickly and accurately. Retain the rectangular shape (preferably with rounded corners) if you renounce the 3-dimensionality. Interactive components in flat design should look clickable even without heavier effects such as shadows and gradients. (In one early study, clicks increased by 416% after changing from flat to 3-D buttons. While the effect is smaller now, it's still big.) (http://www.nngroup.com/articles/clickable-elements/)

              This isn't about aesthetics, this is about affordances. If something is not recognizable as clickable or as being clicked, then there's an affordance problem. Which apparently you acknowledge, but your gripe with the matter is, that this "solution" Eli is offering is not "innovative" – I didn't read anything about a need for innovation.

              1 point
  • Jim SilvermanJim Silverman, over 5 years ago (edited over 5 years ago )

    tl;dr: author prefers skeuomorphic ui and bashes Geoff Teehan's work for no real reason.

    16 points
  • Laurens SpangenbergLaurens Spangenberg, over 5 years ago (edited over 5 years ago )

    First of all, what?

    Unlike designers, users were quick to express their confusion at the new shift key design.

    So designers aren't users; that's new to me.

    Second, why is he suggesting Apple to implement an incredibly skeuomorphic keyboard in an otherwise flat designed OS? I completely agree that the keyboard could use improvements, but that doesn't necessarily require excessive skeuomorphism, which would make the overall design of iOS even more inconsistent.

    It seems to me that Eli simply wants Apple to return to the iOS 6 keyboard given how similar his one is to that.

    10 points
  • Ed AdamsEd Adams, over 5 years ago

    iOS supports custom keyboards now.

    If Eli (or someone else) really wanted to, they could make this keyboard a reality.

    9 points
  • Hamish TaplinHamish Taplin, over 5 years ago

    The author of this blog just comes across as bitter because his design style has gone out of fashion.

    5 points
  • Stephen GraceStephen Grace, over 5 years ago

    Over 7 million people have been displaced in Syria.

    The iOS 9 keyboard is fine.

    4 points
    • Tom WoodTom Wood, over 5 years ago

      Yeah sure, and 717 people were tragically killed in a stampede in Mecca. These are awful, terrible tragedies – however that remark is rather flippant, this is a forum for design discussion and as irritating as Eli Schiff's extended essays are, they do have a place on this site.

      We should encourage discussion such as this, and offer our thoughts and reactions – ideally in a measured manner.

      Again, I understand that getting one's knickers in a twist about the iOS keyboard versus the tragic events befalling millions of migrants is enormously imbalanced. I do. But that's part of DN.

      9 points
      • Stephen GraceStephen Grace, over 5 years ago

        I understand. And usually I don't really like people who make comments like mine. I guess to me it feels like there are bigger problems design could be working towards or trying to fix. I wish I knew of ways we could pool our resources and passion for something like the shift key to a bigger problem. Maybe design isn't the right industry to help, but I hope so.

        2 points