Much easier to read.
And of course, Reddit never disappoints with stupid comments from ignorant people.
Right? Redditors will always find something to bitch about.
agreed, who cares what the users think!
Welllllllllllllll OK. Do you trust fact-based research and user testing or do you trust loudmouthed commenters who will hate on anything and everything that's even the slightest bit different?
i'm not aware there was any research or testing done. can you point me to it? all i see is a series of announcements saying it's coming, with consistently unanswered objections and concerns along the way.
Reddit didn't have to do any in house research or user testing to determine that a slightly larger font and increased line-height leads to increased readability and reduced stress on the eyes, especially in areas where there is a lot of type (such as a comment section or paragraphs of copy). Many many many studies have been done that prove this.
quoting an "ignorant" commenter:
Then why not increase the font 1000x fold? I'll tell you why: Because readability and functionality go hand in hand. You need both. And making the font larger does not increase functionality. It's a net loss from a design perspective. Net loss in user experience and also in information per page. I wish they would have hired someone who actually had some experience with large site designs instead of picking some fresh college grad who is trying to apply their "philosophy of design" courses to a real world situation.
it's a bit aggressive, but completely valid criticism.
It's not a net loss in user experience - making copy and comments easier to read decreases eye stress and most likely will lead to longer times of visits on site and increased engagements from visitors. Thus, it also increases functionality.
In addition, from a design standpoint, having everything set in 12px type with a tight line-height felt like you had to know what was going on to join Reddit. The new, easier to read format feels more welcoming and could lead to increased signups and users, which is a good thing from Reddit's point of view (although not from the angry hivemind hordes).
i'm finding reading a comment to be no easier than it was prior to the change, and it seems that i'm not alone. the larger text is completely imbalanced with the sizing and spacing of the rest of the site. paragraphs run together. windows rendering is poor. it looks out of place.
point being, there are more things at play than simply the
font-size and line-height.
So, perhaps what you're saying is that a reddit design change should be made more holistically? Because a font increase was long overdue on Reddit. I basically avoid that site like the plague because the type & layout is so bad.
This idiot is an idiot. It's not valid criticism.
Then why not increase the font 1000x fold? I'll tell you why: Because readability and functionality go hand in hand.
Because there are diminishing returns after a certain point. By this dolt's logic, why not decrease the font size? Small is good. Smaller is better!
Net loss in user experience and also in information per page.
I don't recall ever hearing that cramming as much text as possible onto a single page is the ultimate user experience.
I wish they would have hired someone who actually had some experience with large site designs
Could you imagine the reaction from jackasses like this if Reddit ever actually went all-in on a redesign?
i believe you've missed the point.
the gripe is that reddit simply increased the comment text size, they've done nothing else to accommodate this change or balance the larger text with the rest of the site. the net result is not an increase in legibility. in fact, most users are having a more difficult time reading comments.
Are they having a more difficult time reading comments, or are they just a bunch of stubborn whiners who would freak out at any hint of change?
This seems like a small positive change. The rest of the site obviously needs a major overhaul, but that's not in the cards. These people aren't complaining that the changes don't go far enough. They're complaining that they're too much.
Completely Unrelated: I wonder if we can get this reply chain to boil down to one character column? Can it be done!? :D
I don't think I've ever seen this much vertical lines on DN before... The end is near
column width is another factor that affects readability which reddit fails at.
+1 for looping it back to the original discussion! a few more replies and i think we can get there
did you say replies? replying is a functionality that's being marginalized by reddit's new body copy.
Perhaps Designer News should consider fixing this narrow comment issue!
This might be considered a feature! Gradually people are less inclined to reply to overly long discussions. I think we can reach the one column goal in 5 more replies.
It's really hurting readability.
Oh no we're getting close!
I'm happy that my first comment here is part of a DN column circlejerk.
nothing can stop this thread.
Damn you scroll bars
ok maybe scroll bars can stop this thread.
I'd like to take this moment to congratulate Jim and Kyle for beginning what will be known in years to come as the first circlejerk of Designer News.
But certainly not the last, I hope
it just keeps on going. :D
What are you guys talking about ?
Scroll bars should be binned.
This is so messed up!
Can't believe you are posting this seriously. This is not valid.
sure is. the body text is the now largest text on the site. core functionality is marginalized because of this. user details, permalink, save, reply are all still tiny as hell. up/downvotes are de-emphasized. it's a hierarchical mess.
But up/downvotes were being de-emphasized pretty dramatically anyway with the last few updates, so I don't think Reddit cares so much about the effect on that aspect.
sounds like a decision that should've included user testing and research.
Who said they didn't? Commenters in a section of the site dedicated to commenting on changes (and I might add, always complaining about any change) are not some sort of confirmation that users do not like this change or that it doesn't meet its goals of improved readability. It's pretty settled that this sort of size+line-height improve readability.
obviously, but that's not the point. the problem is that readability of comments was improved at the cost of overall usability.
"Websites don't use fonts this big because they're harder to read, this makes no sense."
That made my day.
For real, though... If minor changes to a website's appearance command this much control over your emotional state -- then it's time to step away from the computer.
verdana though? top comment there says it all. what a mess.
edit: top comment is no longer top. permalink
Even though Verdana is not as popular as it once was, I still think it is one of the most (if not the most) legible fonts on the web.
it's a relic from an era when 640x480 screens were standard and subpixel rendering didn't exist.
They only place where I like Verdana is on daringfireball.net. But Gruber understands that Verdana looks ok at very small sizes -- easy to read at that size? Not so much.
Gruber even dropped Verdana in favor of Gill Sans for headlines at some point.
How do I read full/long threads on Designer News? This is what I see.
Yep, that's how it looks to the rest of us.
Ahh, gotcha. Thanks!
Pretty ironic that a website for "designers" should have such a fundamentally flawed design.
Ah, those silly redit users and their CSS thingies. Of course it's an entirely reasonable change, why anyone on Earth would argue?
Haha, jk. That's plain awful.
To be honest, I don't really like it. Having said that, it won't stop me going on Reddit. In any event, Reddit is so awful to look at on desktop, I simply view it on an app on my phone. Increasing text size and line height hasn't really done much for them... users seem to either love it or hate it. How about they make it an option they can select and deselect?
The best part is that comments are still smaller than default paragraph sizing.
Personally didn't think the body copy needed a bump but I'm glad to see the code blocks get larger. Hope it isn't an inconvenience to subreddits though.
Hope it isn't an inconvenience to subreddits though.
Every subreddit with custom CSS has to go and make changes. Pretty inconvenient I would say.
That's quite good, but no matter what reddit will be the best community to get information. Even though they decrease its readability.